Interview: SPIKE LEE
Spike Lee sat down with The Hollywood Reporter during his stay in L.A., where he's getting ready for the premiere of his highly anticipated next film Red Hook Summer, which we've talked about on this site quite a few times. Red Hook Summer, about a young man from Atlanta who stays with his preacher grandfather in Brooklyn for the summer, is Lee's first Sundance Film Fest premiere of any of his films; the film screens in a couple of days on January 22nd.
Lee spoke about the problem of Hollywood studios not greenlighting films with mostly black casts, the state of independent black cinema and black cinema in general (topics we've talked about on the site ad nauseam), and his projects in the horizon, which include an adaptation of the Korean thriller OldBoy and a first time collaboration with Eddie Murphy.
The biggest problem of Hollywood not greenlighting black films as far as Lee is concerned? Well, there's no people of color with a greenlight vote!
As for Spike Lee's favorite film of year?? The honor goes to the much talked about sex addiction drama Shame by Steve McQueen.:-)
Here's the full interview below:
THE HOLLYWOOD REPORTER: So this is your first trip to Sundance as a feature director but not your first time with a film in the festival?
Spike Lee: Yes. I came for the first time with the Broadway musical film Passing Strange in 2009. I had a really good conversation with Robert Redford that year. He was 100 percent cool.THR: What was the genesis of Red Hook?
Lee: [Co-writer and novelist] James McBride and I are dear friends. We worked together on Miracle at St. Anna. And we had breakfast one morning at Viand, the best coffee shop in New York, at 61st and Madison, across from Barneys. We were talking about the state of cinema, the state of black cinema, how frustrated I was that I couldn't get the sequel to Inside Man made -- my biggest hit ever.THR: Why couldn't you get the sequel made?
Lee: You'd have to speak to some other people about that. Anyway, I'd just bought this Sony camera, an F3, and I said, "We've got the means and ways and have to make do. We have to make it happen." We just started talking about stories we wanted to tell. He's from Brooklyn too -- Red Hook, in fact -- so we co-wrote the script.THR: Is the film autobiographical for either of you?
Lee: A little. The church where we filmed is the one James' parents founded, the New Brown Memorial Baptist Church.THR: Aside from Clarke Peters, who has appeared on The Wire and Treme, the cast is made up of mostly unknowns. How did you go about assembling the talent?
Lee: I got the best people I could find. I auditioned all over New York City. Also, there is a school in my old Fort Green neighborhood called Ronald Edmonds. I went there, same junior high, but the name has been changed. And there is an acting teacher there, Edward Robinson, a great teacher -- they always have great kids. I started hanging out in the class. That's where I first saw Jules Brown, who plays Flick, and Toni Lysaith, who plays Chaz.THR: In terms of the budget, you're revealing only that it was "SAG Low Budget Agreement" (which per 2011 standards puts it between $625,000 and 937,500). What was the most difficult part of making the film?
Lee: I financed it myself, so we had to do it for a price. I just went to the bank, made some draws and wrote some checks! It was very hard, but we made the movie we wanted to make.THR: Is the film, as many are saying, a return to your roots after more commercial projects like Inside Man and St. Anna?
Lee: I am trying to stay away from this position of me "returning to my roots." As if my roots are that I'm only comfortable working on low-budget, small films. That's not the case at all. I think if people looked at my body of work, they'd see a great breadth of work. (Long pause.) But the fact remains that Hollywood does sequels and prequels. What was it, Mission: Impossible 5 just now?THR: Four.
Lee: Right, four. So it was inconceivable to me that we couldn't get a sequel made to Inside Man. I don't blame Hollywood -- I was naive. Forgive me, I was naive. It was my biggest hit. And we couldn't get a sequel made? I was f--ing naive. It was like it didn't even happen.THR: But who specifically made the decision not to move forward with a sequel?
Lee: Brian Grazer at Imagine? Donna Langley at Universal? You'd have to do some research. Look, I'm not crying over spilt milk or pointing fingers or playing the blame game. We are all grown-ups here. You asked me questions, and I can't speak for other people. [Editor's note: Calls placed to Grazer's office were referred to Universal, which did not immediately return a request for comment.]THR: OK, on to another topic. There have been a few standout offerings from black filmmakers in the past year, Dee Rees' Pariah and Steve McQueen's Shame among them. Do you think opportunities for black directors have improved or worsened since you started making movies in the 1980s?
Lee: Shame is a great film; it's my favorite film of the year. And Dee was a student of mine at NYU graduate film school. I'm an executive producer of Pariah. Anyway, I think there have been some improvements and some steps taken back. But overall, the variety of films being offered to African-American audiences is not where it was 10, 15 years ago. It's very narrow.THR: But doesn't Tyler Perry's huge commercial success suggest that at least a good portion of that audience is being served?
Lee: It's not the same. I just feel the audience doesn't have as many choices as it did back in the day.THR: Do you think it's more that the content is not being written, or it's simply not being greenlighted, or both?
Lee: Look, take away the big stars -- Will Smith and Denzel -- and look at the people who have a greenlight vote. Where are the people of color? That's what it comes down to. How many people, when they have those meetings and vote on what movies get made, how many people of color are in those meetings? That's not to say that's the only way to get a film made, but you're talking about Hollywood specifically here. And if you want to get a Hollywood film made, it has to get greenlit. And I want someone to tell me: Who is a person of color who has a greenlight vote in this industry today? Some can argue, "Will Smith doesn't need the vote." Well, if Will wants to do the phone book, they still have to vote on it! He's not writing the check. Someone still has to write the check for what Will wants to do. I'm talking about the people sitting in the room who have read the script -- looking at the full package, who's in it, how much is it going to cost, how much is it going to make. The people who have that vote, there are no people of color who have that. And people are going to be in trouble. The U.S. Census has said white Americans are going to be a minority in this country by 2040. I just think it's good business sense to plan for that! The country is changing, and some people just don't want to understand that. I don't know how you can't take that into account. The smart people are going to take that number into account of how they do business.THR: Hollywood has a tough time looking more than a few years out.
Lee: Yeah, it does. Look, I'm not using this interview to slam Hollywood. I'm just saying, I want to know: Who is a black person in Hollywood who has that vote? If you ask a studio, they aren't going to tell you.THR: The only black executive I can think of offhand with definitive power in the film business is Vanessa Murchison at Fox Animation.
Lee: Let's leave animation out of it. (Laughs.) Let's stick to live action. Forgive me, I do know her, and she does have great power at Fox, though. But I'm talking about live-action features.THR: George Lucas appeared Jan. 9 on The Daily Show to promote his Tuskegee Airmen action-drama Red Tails and said the studios he approached had no clue how to market a "black action movie." How do you feel about this?
Lee: Yeah, I was at the premiere. Here's the thing: One of the reasons the studios don't know how to market the film is that they have no black people in the marketing departments! At least any people with say-so. Again, this is bigger than just a marketing problem. What about the greenlight committee? That's the bigger issue. That's the heart of the matter. This is not a revelation; this is truth.THR: Well, it was certainly novel that a white person in Hollywood, especially someone of Lucas' stature, would be so public on this particular topic.
Lee: Well, George Lucas got "f-- you" money. (Laughs.) They're not going to mess with him. In any case, I watch football, and the Red Tails commercials are hot. The commercials are definitely running on TV.THR: Looking at the most successful movie of the year to feature black talent, The Help, why do you think the film was able to transcend racial boundaries and be both a commercial and critical hit?
Lee: OK, let me ask you a question: Why did Driving Miss Daisy win best picture in 1989? That's my answer.THR: So you're saying they're both period films in which the black actors portray servants?
Lee: Stacey, Stacey, Stacey. That's my answer [above]. I don't need to elaborate.THR: Besides Shame, are there other movies or TV shows you've seen recently that blew you away?
Lee: Yeah, I loved Attack the Block; it's a British indie film starring John Boyega, who is also the lead in this pilot I shot for HBO: The Brick, with Doug Ellin from Entourage.THR: You're also slated to direct HBO's film about former D.C. Mayor Marion Barry with Eddie Murphy. How is it that you and Eddie have never worked together?
Lee: I know. Never! We've talked about it for many years. We were never able to come up with something we both could agree on. Hanging out together is going to be a motherf--er! (Laughs.)THR: You've never shied away from politics in your films. How does the current landscape make you feel about being black in America?
Lee: Look, I support the president. In fact, my wife [attorney Tonya Lewis Lee] and I are having a fund-raising dinner [on Jan. 19] for Obama at our house on the Upper East Side. We got the call directly from the White House.THR: Back to Red Hook Summer. How long was your shoot?
Lee: Nineteen days. Roughly three six-day weeks.THR: That's fast. Was the schedule the toughest part of the production?
Lee: She's Gotta Have It was 12 days. (Laughs.) So, no.THR: Do you prefer that guerrilla pace of filmmaking?
Lee: One of the great things about African-Americans is that we've always had this attitude: We make do with what we got. It comes from our ancestors being slaves. You can't bitch and moan about what you don't got. It's, "What can you do with what you got?" I've got a minimum amount of money; that dictates the shooting days. And James and I wrote the script. It takes place in Red Hook, and we shot everything within a 10-block radius. We gotta make do with what we got.THR: Is it true that you reprise your role of Mookie from Do the Right Thing in Red Hook?
Lee: Yeah, but he's not the focus.THR: So it's present-day Mookie as an older man?
Lee: Yes, much older. (Laughs.)THR: How has your storytelling style changed since you made Do the Right Thing?
Lee: Hopefully I'm better.THR: What do you think is your signature as a filmmaker?
Lee: Well, I have a signature shot. I like people to look like they're floating. But as a filmmaker? I think it's easy to look at Do the Right Thing, Malcolm X, Jungle Fever and say, "Spike only deals with themes of race." And I think that's just from someone who's lazy, who hasn't seen the films or gone to IMDb to look at the body of work! It takes 10 seconds.THR: On the subject of the Web, how much, if at all, do you use social media to promote yourself?
Lee: I'm on Twitter. It's fun.THR: What have you learned about your fans from being on the site?
Lee: They're waiting for the next movie. I have 150,000 followers. I started tweeting on my birthday last year, March 20.THR: Do you find you get criticized as much as praised?
Lee: Oh yeah. "Spike! The Knicks f--ing suck! Yankees suck! New York sucks! You suck the big one, Spike!" But I just block those people.THR: You're now working on an English-language version of the Korean thriller Oldboy, starring Josh Brolin and Clive Owen. Is there another project you're hoping to tackle someday?
Lee: I'd love to do a musical with Prince, Stevie Wonder or Kanye [West]. That wouldn't all be one movie! They're my dream collaborators.THR: Is there anything else you'd like to add about Red Hook Summer before Sundance?
Lee: We're looking forward to sharing something with the world. And if God is willing and the creek don't rise, we'll have a distributor and a summer release. As the great Jets linebacker Bart Scott has been quoted as saying, "Can't wait."
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Watch Spike Lee's
Infamous Rant At Sundance
Well this sure has been Spike Lee Week this week on S & A hasn't it?
The other day I posted an item about Spike Lee's notorious angry rant after the screening of Red Hook Summer at Sundance that has gotten a lot of attention by media, and has been the buzz on Twitter or Facebook everywhere. Even Spike yesterday publicly apologized for the rant even saying that his wife was furious at him.
But someone at the event taped the whole 20 minute Q and A (and in HD too) so you can see for yourself and decide if it was all the big shocking event that it was claimed to be.
>via: http://blogs.indiewire.com/shadowandact/watch-spike-lees-infamous-rant-at-sun...
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James McBride
(Co-Writer Of "Red Hook Summer")
Pens Open Letter Addressing
Spike Lee/Sundance Fuss
Several people, including the folks at 40 Acres, sent this to me this morning; and I've since noticed that it's been traveling the web, usually with lots of "hoo-hah" accompanying it by those sharing it, as well as within the comments that follow.
Spike Lee's co-writer of Red Hook Summer, James McBride (who also penned the script for Miracle At St Anna) took it upon himself to address critical reactions to Red Hook Summer, as well as Spike's post-screening premiere *chat* that's also been passed around quite a bit.
McBride wrote a letter to Hollywood, and I suppose the rest of us titled “Being a Maid," in which he essentially decries the state of things in Hollywood where black people are concerned, and the challenges Spike faced in gettingRed Hook Summer made, comparisons to George Lucas and Red Tails, and more.
In it, he says things that we've already talked about ad naseam on S&A, notably the same old Hollywood doesn't care about black people lament that we've heard over and over and over again; and to which I always respond, over and over and over again, so what do we do now?
McBride also addresses the attention black people gave to George Lucas's statement about Hollywood not wanting to fund the movie because of its all-black cast, and all the "support Red Tails or black cinema will die" chants we all read and heard leading up to the film's release. McBride compares that to reactions to when Spike makes similar comments and isn't met with a similar fervent reaction.
If you recall my post, Yes, Support Red Tails; Just Don't Forget Spike Lee, AFFRM & The Black Indie Film Movement, you'll remember that I pretty much made a similar case, wondering whether Red Hook Summer would get a similar push, since Spike also funded the movie himself, much like Lucas did for Red Tails; and in my review of the film, I made the following statement addressing Lucas' comment about Hollywood not financing the movie because of its all-black cast: "Maybe because it came from the mouth of a white man, and we all somehow felt like our plight had been validated - like that would make much of a difference in that plight anyway." My point being that we (black people) have been saying that shit for decades now, but it's never really been followed with as much excitment as there was over Lucas' statement.
McBride also throws a few grenades, like taking a swipe at folks like us here on S&A, saying "Within minutes, the internet lit up with burning personal criticism of him stitched into negative reviews of “Red Hook Summer” by so-called film critics and tweeters." Maybe he wasn't speaking to S&A directly (my review of the film certainly didn't contain any of what he called "burning personal criticism," although it was a negative review; it was actually more like a plea to Spike to talk about what his intentions were for the film), but I'd say it's a bit presumptuous of McBride to jab the same people he probably expects will help his open letter reach readers (after all, 40 Acres, where the letter resides, sent it out to blog editors to read and share with their readers).
But I'll let you read the letter and judge for yourselves (or not).
Here are 2 of the more incendiary paragraphs from the piece:
But this kind of cultural war puts minority storytellers – Blacks, Asians, Latinos and people of color – at a distinct disadvantage. My friend Spike Lee is a clear example. Three days ago, at the premiere of Red Hook Summer at The Sundance Film Festival, Spike, usually a cool and widely accepting soul whose professional life is as racially diverse as any American I know– lost his cool for 30 seconds. When prompted by a question from Chris Rock who was seated in the audience, he blurted out a small, clear truth: He said one reason we did Red Hook Summer independently was because he could not get Hollywood to green light the follow-up to “Inside Man” – which cost only $45 million to make and grossed a whopping $184,376,240 million domestically and worldwide – plus another $37 million domestically on DVD sales. Within minutes, the internet lit up with burning personal criticism of him stitched into negative reviews of “Red Hook Summer” by so-called film critics and tweeters. I don’t mind negative reviews. That’s life in the big leagues. But it’s the same old double standard. The recent success of “Red Tails” which depicts the story of the all black Tuskegee Airmen, is a clear example. Our last film, “Miracle At St. Anna,” which paid homage to the all-black 92nd Division, which fought on the ground in Italy, was blasted before it even got out the gate. Maybe it’s a terrible film. Maybe it deserved to bomb. The difference is this: When George Lucas complained publicly about the fact that he had to finance his own film because Hollywood executives told him they didn’t know how to market a black film, no one called him a fanatic. But when Spike Lee says it, he’s a racist militant and a malcontent. Spike’s been saying the same thing for 25 years. And he had to go to Italy to raise money for a film that honors American soldiers, because unlike Lucas, he’s not a billionaire. He couldn’t reach in his pocket to create, produce, market, and promote his film like Lucas did with “Red Tails.”
But there’s a deeper, even more critical element here , because it’s the same old story: Nothing in this world happens unless white folks says it happens. And therein lies the problem of being a professional black storyteller– writer, musician, filmmaker. Being black is like serving as Hoke, the driver in “Driving Miss Daisy,” except it’s a kind of TV series lasts the rest of your life: You get to drive the well-meaning boss to and fro, you love that boss, your lives are stitched together, but only when the boss decides your story intersects with his or her life is your story valid. Because you’re a kind of cultural maid. You serve up the music, the life, the pain, the spirituality. You clean house. Take the kids to school. You serve the eggs and pour the coffee. And for your efforts the white folks thank you. They pay you a little. They ask about your kids. Then they jump into the swimming pool and you go home to your life on the outside, whatever it is. And if lucky you get to be the wise old black sage that drops pearls of wisdom, the wise old poet or bluesman who says ‘I been buked and scorned,’ and you heal the white folks, when in fact you can’t heal anybody. In fact, you’re actually as dumb as they are, dumber maybe, because you played into the whole business. Robbing a character of their full dimension, be it in fiction or non fiction, hurts everyone the world over. Need proof? Ask any Native American, Asian, Latino, Gay American, or so called white “hillbilly.” As if hillbillies don’t read books, and Asians don’t rap, and Muslims don’t argue about the cost of a brake job.
[...]
It was terrible lesson for a young man fresh out of college and I did my best to forget it. But I understand it then and I understand it now: This is what happens when you walk through a supermarket and hear muzak playing ninth chords borrowed from your history; when you see instructions books made from the very harmonic innovations you created, and in my case, when you spend a lifetime watching films that spoof your community. Your entire culture is boiled down to greasy gut bucket jokester films, pornographic bling-rap, or poverty porn.
So there ya have it; my question is still the same: so now what?
I'd be remiss if I didn't mention that I didn't get to talk to Spike, or the film's cast at Sundance this week while I was there; I never got an invite to RSVP for a slot to interview cast and/or crew (others apparently did); but I did get an invite to cover the red carpet premiere... but just the red carpet - you know, take pictures of the celebrities as they walk into the theater, and asked them superficial questions. I passed. I don't do red carpet. I don't see the point. But obviously I was good enough to cover the red carpet for S&A, but S&A obviously isn't good enough to get time with the film's cast and crew, even though other indieWIRE sites apparently did. The one site within the indieWIRE network that focuses on *black cinema* didn't get to talk to the black filmmaker and black cast of one of the most anticipated films (black films) screening at the festival.
Why? I don't know. I wasn't given a reason. Maybe I didn't make my request early enough? I don't know. So I'm just left to speculate.
I think we've been fair and balanced in our coverage of Spike and his films. There's been criticism certainly, but there's also beein praise; lots of it actually. And my review of Red Hook Summer was probably one of the least virulent.
But my request still stands; if Spike Lee (I'd rather get it directly from him) would be so kind to grant S&A an interview about Red Hook Summer, I'd love to talk to him about the film, the biz, the challenges he's faced, etc, etc, etc.
In the meantime, you can read McBride's entire piece HERE.
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Spike Lee's 'Red Hook Summer'
Screened At Sundance
Offers A Nuanced Overview
Of African American Christianity
By Dick Staub
Religion News Service
PARK CITY, Utah (RNS) I have a confession to make.
The only real reason I saw Spike Lee's new film at the Sundance Film Festival here is because it is set in the Red Hook section of Brooklyn, where my oldest daughter started her career in an elementary school with Teach for America.
Even though I think and write about religion for a living, I didn't attend "Red Hook Summer" because the program guide describes it as the story of a "firebrand preacher bent on getting (his grandson) to accept Jesus Christ as his personal savior."
After all, why would anyone expect a nuanced, respectful exploration of the black church in America from Spike Lee? Let's face it, the words "Spike Lee" and "theologian" don't roll off the tongue very easily, if at all.
So imagine my surprise when "Red Hook Summer" delivered a humorous, honest look at the vibrancy, complexity, sincerity and messiness of African-American Christianity.
The story begins with Flik, a teenager who attends a private school in Atlanta and enjoys the finer things of life. His life is turned upside down when his mother sends him off to Brooklyn for the summer to stay with his preacher grandfather, Enoch.
Flik is certainly unprepared for life in the projects, but is even less prepared for working every day at his grandfather's Little Piece of Heaven church. The only upside is meeting Chazz, a sassy teen who has learned to negotiate life on the streets of Red Hook with her life in the church.
She's a believer but not stuffy about it, and helps Flik get through the Sunday worship service, which is punctuated by Enoch's theatrical rants, the spirited "Amens!" of the congregation and the melodramatic sounds of the Hammond organ.
The heart of this film is grandpa Enoch. As the story begins we get hints that Enoch is a man with a past, and it reaches its dramatic climax when we realize that though Enoch is done with his past, his past is not done with him.
Clarke Peters (Det. Lester Freamon from "The Wire") in the role of Enoch delivers a textured, multi-layered performance that does for the role of a black pastor what Robert Duvall did for revivalists in "The Apostle." These characters are believable, complicated and likable.
At the Q&A following the film, it was obvious that I wasn't the only one surprised that Lee delivered a thoughtful, respectful and savvy film about religion. The first audience question was about Lee's personal religious background. He never attended church as a boy in Brooklyn, he explained, although some summers he was sent to stay with relatives in Atlanta who made sure he did.
Suffice it to say that church and religion have not played a central role in Lee's life.
So what is the source of the film's religious content? To answer that question, Lee introduced his co-author on the script, James McBride, and the richness of the film immediately made complete sense.
I interviewed McBride in Chicago in the 1990's about his best-selling book "The Color of Water." It was an autobiographical account of his Jewish mother who converted to Christianity and, with her husband, founded the church where "Red Hook Summer" was filmed.
McBride talked about his belief in God and Jesus, and said his faith was renewed and strengthened during the writing and making of the film. He also talked about spirited debates with Lee about certain scenes where McBride's desire to respect religion collided with Lee's determination to keep it gritty and real. It was a productive tension, and it worked.
I still find it fascinating that Lee would make a film about religion, and that he teamed up with McBride to do it. Sundance is all about telling stories, and "Red Hook Summer" tells a center-stage story about the importance of religion.
(Dick Staub is author of "About You: Fully Human and Fully Alive" and the host of The Kindlings Muse (www.thekindlings.com). His blog can be read at www.dickstaub.com)
